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Luck expert reveals how to increase your luck surface area in sales
Entrepreneurship expert and creator of Hacking Luck™, Stephanie Melodia, breaks down how salespeople can increase their luck - across both mindset principles and practical actions - on The S Word with podcast co-host, sales trainer, and founder of The Good Sales Company, Tash Rebuck.
Drawing on her own research as well as insights from sales leader, Joel Lebon and the 'godfather of luck,' Dr. Richard Wiseman, Stephanie shares practical tips, fascinating insights, and hot takes on the whole topic of luck - while sales trainer and co-host, Tash Rebuck, shares their own brushes with luck across their career, with key lessons throughout.
Watch the episode below, or keep reading for the transcript:
Chapters:
00:00 Are some people just lucky?
02:24 Talent, effort or luck?
03:53 The science of luck
04:27 Hacking Luck for sales teams
05:05 Science; not sage and crystals
05:40 Joel LeBon: luck as a controllable factor in sales
07:04 Tash's luckiest sales moment
10:29 There's more in your control than you think
12:14 Mindset, stress and spotting opportunities
15:29 Curiosity and open questions on sales calls
18:38 Why believing in luck can hold you back
21:26 The Bloom100: why top founders reject luck
22:29 Privilege, self-doubt and gratitude
25:38 Hacking Luck as an OS for the age of AI
28:22 The more risks I take, the luckier I get
29:13 Random mode and zagging: variance, not volume
31:47 The private jet trip that went viral
33:37 The power law vs the law of averages
35:12 The strength of weak ties
36:15 The ripple effect: from a WhatsApp group to this podcast
39:40 Key takeaways
40:28 Outro
TR: What we are going to be talking about today is something that I'm pretty sure everyone in the world has felt at some point:
You look at the person next to you and you think... that lucky bugger!
And, sure, comparison is the thief of joy, but what if we can create it for ourselves?
This is something that I think plagues us all the time because, as a salesperson, you can get the same training as someone. You can get all the same opportunities. You're sat there with the same tools as them. Or maybe you're a founder on an accelerator program and you're next to all these other people, with the same problems as you, same opportunities, and yet… Aren't they lucky? Isn't that lucky?
Incredibly, there's actually some science behind it. So, I am a rapt audience member as much as I think anyone listening because we have an expert on luck in the room. I want to harness luck. So, Steph, please tell us a little bit about hacking luck and how we can make ourselves and our sales processes and experience lucky.
SM: (2:24) Fantastic. I love it. Well, thank you so much for teeing me up there so perfectly. There's so much I am excited to dive into. What I'm going to open with is the same opening question that I share at the start of my keynotes: what matters most when it comes to success; talent, effort, or luck?
This has actually now become a bit of an anecdotal research because I'm so lucky to have presented in multiple places around the world, whether it's been at a startups conference in Malta, whether it's been a private corporate client in Doha, whether it's a private members club in New York or a women in tech conference in Sweden… The opening question has served as a litmus test on people’s beliefs. Now, more often than not, and - spoiler alert - whichever one you think it is, do leave a comment, but probably given that fantastic intro and the title of this episode, you know what's coming. When I ask the audience members, the majority do raise their hand to the effort part of the talent, effort, luck equation - which I would have done as well up until a few years ago, too, by the way.
TR: (3:40) I'd probably have gone talent and effort being difficult.
SM: (3:44) Okay, yeah. Well, you’d definitely be in the majority with the effort piece and you wouldn't be completely wrong either.
So, a few years ago, this was the headline on a Forbes article that I came across that actually triggered this whole thing for me. (What matters most; talent, effort or luck?) So, I went deep down the rabbit hole, and I appreciate you calling me the expert on luck here because very much self-made, self-taught, and you're right, there is so much fascinating research. It is crazy. the rabbit holes that I've been down in terms of published PhD papers, scientific experiments, studies on hundreds of people, simulations, it honestly goes on and on and on.
Quick ad break
(4:27) Here's a random question for you:
We've all heard the phrase create your own luck, right?
But… is it actually possible?
Can we create our own luck? Is it possible to manufacture serendipity and stack the odds in our favor?
Not only do I believe so, I have the data to prove it. I've distilled down eight core principles in my signature framework, Hacking Luck™, to train sales teams to literally stack the odds in their favor. That means increasing pipeline and driving more conversions.
From increasing your risk tolerance to exercising your resilience muscle, from strategic visibility to something I like to call zagging.
Get in touch here to make your sales teams luckier today.
TR: (5:07) So, this isn't just someone whipping some sage around a room and being like, I've put my crystal in the moonlight for a solar eclipse kind of thing. This is science-backed.
SM: (5:19) Absolutely. Unless it is the Lionsgate portal and we-
TR: (5:22) Don't! we can't get into it again!
SM: (5:25) -Sirius is aligned with Venus or whatever it is. But we're gonna come back to that
as well because this whole topic is a bit of a paradoxical mind f#*k actually. I'm going to reveal that afterwards.
So what I want to do is I've established that there is a lot of science behind this - I've come across so many different studies and research papers and bestselling books on the topic, as I've mentioned - but there was one in particular by a male professor called Joel LeBon which actually connects more specifically to sales.
He did a research piece and showed that luck should be viewed as a controllable determinant of salespeople's achievement. Success derives not from effort alone but from a combination of effort and luck. Enter Hacking Luck™, baby, because the hacking piece to that is the effort because we are stacking the odds in our favor. So that's where the first sort of paradox comes in. Luck has been proven time and time again to have the biggest bearing on our success or failure but the hacking piece to that is obviously manufacturing serendipity.
6:38 I'm going to dive into some of the top qualities found in sales people:
Obviously we've got resilience, positivity, openness, and curiosity.
In one study that the same Joel LeBon conducted, he found that more than 2/3s of sales teams reported their success resulted from lucky circumstances.
Now, this is where I want to throw it over to you: can you recount a particular moment across your entire sales career, including your company, The Good Sales Company now, where you've really felt like, "Oh my god, this was a stroke of luck"?
TR: (7:20) Yes. There was one experience that, to this day, I still think is the luckiest sales situation I've ever seen. So, I in my first job, so I worked for a games company. We all had our own sectors and you kind of say that's a little bit luck and not luck - you know, one person sold into museums that have lots of money, one person sold into schools that bizarrely really love making their own edition of board games, I had culture in the year that David Cameron cut the arts and culture - so I was super unlucky when it came to my sector.
8:15 One of my colleagues, it was my manager at the time had sports and he had, for the most part, I would say is also just bloody lucky for having that as and worked very hard to get it earned it. It's a big sector. He earned it but also super lucky to have it.
8:36 So about 10 years or so ago there was a football team that won a bunch of cups. A big cup, a cup they weren't expected to win. They went from a bad league to the best league and that was a surprise. And then I think they won it.
SM: (8:53) Thank you for making that Steph-friendly because that's as much as I know about sports!
TR: (8:58) Exactly. Oh, anyone listening will be like, I know exactly who she's talking about because it was totally unprecedented.
SM: (9:04) Not me.
TR: (9:05) No. And I wouldn't have known if I wasn't in the company.
SM: (9:08) Yeah.
TR: (9:09) I work in sales, so all I've ever done is hear people talk about football. Anyway, he has a pitch with this team that had been in for a little while and in between it being booked, they were feeling pretty confident. They they were doing really well. So, they were like, "Yeah, we'll invest some money." In between him booking the pitch and us going to the meeting, they won the League Cup ball,
SM: (9:32) The Hogwarts finals.
TR: (9:33) Yeah.
SM: (9:34) Quidditch.
TR: (9:35) Something. And we went to that meeting and he sat down at the desk and the guy went, "Show me what you've got." And he goes, "You're up for everything." And he was like, "Yep." And he says, "Yep, not surprised now you've won.” Because you know how much money they get and how much money gets invested into them. It's a lot. Basically, he pulls out every single version of a game that we have with a different top football team on it. all different because all of them do it. And he's like, "Which do you want?" And the guy goes, "That one, that one, that one, that one." All of them. And he goes, "Do you want the minimum orders? I wouldn't recommend it. You're going to pre-sale X." Blah, blah, blah. This is where the price breaks are. Okay, cool. I'll send the invoice on the way home.
SM: (10:26) Amazing.
TR: (10:27) It was like a 10-minute meeting.
SM: (10:29) Wow. Amazing. Just goes to show, right? That's a really good example of this lucky scenario because it was something that was totally out of your control. And to a degree, I know that luck is talked about a lot in the field of sports because of course it's that I think it's one of the most obvious analogies you can make, right? Where it's like you have a game on the field or the court or the Quidditch thing, whatever you're playing on, right? And it's like you can have the best coaching, you can have the best training, you can do your best to cast the most talented athletes and all the rest of it, but there's always going to be these externalities outside of your control.
My key message that I will drill down over and over until the day that I die is there is always always more in our control than we first believe. So yes, there is the legitimate there are things inside outside of your control, there are legitimate externalities, but beyond basically the weather and nature, there's a lot more than you think. And an image speaks a thousand words, so, the really powerful image I use in my presentations at this point is of this strong horse, this like big stallion that's tied to a plastic chair. And I see this happen so much, especially with my more kind of coaching roles and mentor to entrepreneurs, especially first-time business owners, and you're entering into the unknown and you're pushing yourself and you're doing these things that you didn't think you were capable of. Again, the sports analogy is perfect for that as well. It really is amazing how many barriers we put up in our own way.
12:14 And so what that nicely links me on to the next kind of piece here is I've done a lot of research. Well, I've reviewed other people's research as well as done my own on the topic. And most of the existing stuff that's out there does actually speak to one of the internal things that's in your control which is very powerful is the mindset.
Now, to be very clear to anyone listening, I do build on that and take it further rooted in my expertise in entrepreneurship by making it very practical and very action-oriented. So I talk about things like taking risks, zagging which is going against the grain, strategic visibility, networking. These are all kind of some of the elements that are much more practical.
But, on the mindset thing, to touch on: this same study by Joel LeBon, he did also attribute those lucky events with those more successful salespeople to a positive mindset which we talk about all the time as well, right? This was also backed up by a male psychologist, Dr. Richard Wiseman, the author of The Luck Factor. So he's kind of the godfather on the whole kind of luck topic. He has shown that stress and tension narrow a person's focus leading them to miss unexpected cues.
13:28 You're fantastic at this and this is something I'm not sure how much you realise the opportunities that you spot that other people don't. So I think this is another very important connecting piece into the sales topic because what I do here, how I bring it to life in a workshop or a talk setting is I'll get people to look around the room and count how many things they can see of a certain color. So, let's just say yellow. And then I asked them, okay, how many things did you spot that were blue? And obviously I don't know, I was just looking at the yellow things.
Another one that's really crazy, it worked on me when I first did it, but it now works all the time with everyone is a quote that I'll get people to read off on screen. And, spoiler alert, it says ‘Paris in the the springtime’ and everyone misses the second the.
TR: (14:23) Everyone! And I knew what you were doing as well! Same the yellow thing. I was like, it's a trick thing. I've got to be thinking of something else. So even when you're trying to be in that mindset, not naturally being in it, like trying to force it.
SM: (14:38) That's exactly it. And it goes back to that paradox. This is where brain hacking yourself isn't that easy because you have to do these things that it's just like the placebo effect, right? Where you have to allow these things to happen without you forcing it or being intentional about it. And so being open-minded, being relaxed because that's exactly it, isn't it? It's like you tell someone to relax, you're like, "Okay, fine. Am I relaxed now?" You know, it's exactly the perfect example.
So it's being relaxed, not stressed. This is where your fun sales trainings, your workshops, are perfect for it as well. You put everyone at ease, you develop that psychological safety in your organisation which is so vital for this as well so that you can be aware of these opportunities that people just don't miss. Linked to that as well is the curiosity - is having that open-mindedness - so I think one of the very practical parts to that to throw back to you here is on the open questions we talk about right and being curious.
At this point, can you share some top tips to kind of be open to either discover covering opportunities during a sales call or just kind of exercising that curiosity yourself as a sales professional?
TR: (15:57) A good way to do it is just to practice. So I have an exercise that I do with my clients after we do sales pitch training and one of the things I do in that is what I've made you do before which is to and if anyone hasn't listened to the episode it's a very good one. It's called what's my secret or work out the riddle. We have different names. Go find it. You'll do it, I believe in you! But I will use that exercise which in the episode was a really fun not sales related but then I'll use real ones for their business.
SM: (16:35) Amazing.
TR: (16:35) And so it will be like, okay so you're pitching to me like you're my client. I'm pretending to be a prospect. Here's what you do know, but what you don't know is there's another thing that you need to find out about. And so by doing that kind of exercise with someone, you know you have to do that. So you're just training that muscle. And the first few times you'll get it wrong, but the more you do it, the better you are at opening your questions and being curious about answers and asking more questions. Even if it's a bit boring and takes a while, once you get there,
SM: (17:15) I could not have hoped for a more perfect example. Honestly, that is spot on. And that's how we take this kind of broader, more generalised spotting opportunities, finding some money on the floor. This is actually a way that we're kind of converting that to a real-world sales environment where it is lean into that curiosity. You don't know what you might discover. Like leave no stone unturned. So that's all part of that topic, right? The openness, the curiosity to explore and kind of see what you might discover along the way.
TR: (17:47) Do you know the image that comes to mind is that cartoon of two people in a car?
SM: (17:54) Exactly, yeah!
TR: (17:56) One's looking at the miserable rock and one's looking at the view and it's like, where are you looking? What's your perspective?
SM: (18:01) And that's exactly my point, right? Like the brain is so good at tricking us all the time. All the time. Someone can have the exact same experience and come away feeling like they put their foot in their mouth, they said the wrong thing and the other person thought it was hilarious. They didn't even notice. This happens all the time, right?
TR: All the time.
SM: So, it can really trip people up because of course we do believe our own thoughts, but of course, not everything you think is true.
18:31 And so, that's the kind of that's where there's so much already out there on the whole kind of mindset piece. Now I'm going to come to something that I actually disagree with Lebon about and this kind of cast more of that paradox.
18:43 Don't fight.
18:45 If you can take down Chris Voss then I can take down Joel LeBon here!!
So Joel LeBon attributed the highest performing salespeople to their belief in luck. This is kind of the red thread throughout the conversation so far, right? So he's written: a salesperson's best tool for getting through the valley of despair is a firm belief in luck.
Now, this is actually the paradox because what I think is helpful - and learning from the best here as well! - is having that optimistic attitude because obviously - why would you keep picking up the phones? Why would you keep following up? Why would you put yourself out there? Why would you keep knocking down doors if obviously you don't believe that you're going to get anything out of it? So that is obvious.
But where it's problematic is attributing it to luck, because this is the paradox and this is where I'm saying it's almost like the placebo effect and I wrote this piece where I just had to have this image you know the scene in Men in Black where he pulls out the what's it called like the neuralizer or something which just wipes the memory. It's almost like I need to take out I see if I can find something on eBay. I need to get a men in black neuralizer at the end of my presentations to be like now forget everything because it's not helpful.
20:08 What is helpful is your optimism, is your tenacity, is your belief that contradictorily you're in control even though you're not. Because let's face it, we're spinning at hundreds of thousands of kilometers per hour on a blue marble through space. Nobody thinks about that. So that certainty is an illusion. This is where we can be creatures of routine or creatures of habit. We like our routines. We like to feel in control. We like to feel that we get out what we put in. So it's almost like you have to convince yourself of that fact.
TR: It would make me complacent.
SM: Exactly.
TR: It would lessen the work that I do because I like the idea of being like I create my own luck and then lucky things happen. But I would still want to be like, "But I made this situation."
SM: (21:01) Exactly. And not only is it the complacency, you're totally right, but it is also the disempowerment of it.
21:07 And my whole message is the opposite - there is a lot more that's in your control. And it is a lot more empowering, especially now with AI, but that's a whole other conversation.
TR: (21:15) I love that. That changes my opinion on luck. You're getting a convert in me.
SM: This wasn't staged, gang! We're getting to see the conversion happening in real time. She gives her soul over to Lady Luck here!
So, as I said, one thing is having an optimistic attitude. Another is that belief in luck. So, I mentioned before, there's a lot of this other existing research that's out there. My own research is an analysis of 120 interviews with top entrepreneurs in the country as well as 100 startup clients that we had at my last business, which is now called (21:49) The Bloom 100. And this is where the paradox has emerged:
21:52 The most successful don't attribute their success to luck. And actually, some outright reject it. Like it's not even real. I don't even- I just completely reject the whole concept of it.
So, if that works for you to believe that you're in control to stack the odds in your favor, then more power to you. Where I'm going to get kind of spicy with this is the correlation between the most privileged and that rejection of luck, because it's nicer to tell yourself that when you succeed, you winning was down to your hard work and your effort. And it also makes it easier to excuse the people who didn't have the same success by saying they didn't work hard enough.
TR: (22:53) Ooh… Here's another thought: I wonder if it's also the fact that people who come from a less privileged background, there's a lot more self-doubt that is pushed on them as well because of their background. And so potentially they see their success even though they know they've worked hard for it, they still are like, "Oh, I'm just lucky." Because they have that a larger amount of self-doubt.
It's just interesting that the people who may actually attribute it a bit to luck in the way they were born. But those who really didn't would be like, "Oh, no. I'm just lucky."
SM: (23:30) Yeah. And what that does link to is the research on gratitude.
I think we were saying with that kind of humility and feeling much more grateful for when you do get those strokes of luck that come your way (which, then again, back to that positive mindset it creates that kind of upward cycle where the more things that you notice are going right it's like what's that phrase the uh the better it gets the better it gets. Because you just keep noticing more of that stuff. That gratitude as well is such positive energy).
I'm gonna skip along a little bit here because in my framework there's eight different components which I won't go through all of here-
TR: And if anyone is sat here being like I need Steph to transform people's brains the way that Tash's brain has just been transformed then you need to have her come in and speak to either your sales team or just your whole bloody company to be honest because this is something that applies to everyone really.
25:34 So, yeah, there's so much more to dive into. I appreciate that plug.
What I want to end this on has to be (selfishly) my most favorite but I will definitely say it very clearly does link to sales in particular and it is random mode, network effects, and zagging - kind of putting them all into the same bucket here.
I mentioned there's eight different principles that's building on this existing research as well as my own analysis and one of the best ways especially now where I've been writing a lot more about how Hacking Luck™ is not only a practical framework for stacking the odds in your favor, but with so much in flux and so much change that AI has brought along now, it's an OS for human capital in the age of AI.
26:32 What do I mean by that? What I mean is it's more about there are many issues with AI at the moment and one of them coming from an ex-marketeter branding storytelling is the narrative around AI. It's very disempowering. It's very much "AI is here whether you like it or not,""the horses already bolted," "get with it or lose out" - which I completely reject. I don't only reject that, but it genuinely presents an opportunity for us to rewrite the rules of how do we work now? Because I've spoken before about, you know, when we've reflected on previous jobs and even just that, like the way that we used to work, especially BC (Before COVID), like that was so different.
27:16 With AI now, the opportunity that is presenting is we need to play games that we can win and we're not going to win the productivity game with AI in the equation right and for me this is good news because the whole obsession with productivity is a hangover from the industrial revolution of over 250 years ago
27:36 So that's where with Hacking Luck™ where we talk especially on this last piece around kind of network effects, random mode, zagging these are ways that we can kind of work.
This isn't like anti-AI or like human versus tech or anything, but it is about asking, okay, where do we now have an edge not only as like human capital in an organisation, but like fantastic news for anyone who's neurodivergent, right? Like if you don't think like a machine and you don't operate like cogs in a wheel, then this is fantastic news for you.
TR: (28:08) It is. I like genuinely it's like brilliant for me. I'm chuffed, yeah. Especially some of the things you haven't had a chance to mention like taking risks. I mean as an ADHD person that's all we ever do is like take silly risks!
SM: (28:18) I love it, I love it. I'm so here for that. And with the risk - I mean they're all my favorites but now you brought it up, I will mention very very briefly;
There are so many quotes and sayings about luck that obviously everyone wants to tell me about. One of them that we've all heard of is “the harder I work the luckier I get.” And that loops all the way back to my opening question. What matters the most; talent, effort or luck? And so that's not true. The re-written version of that is “the more risks I take, the luckier I get.”
So I wanted to touch on that on your risk point there. But again, that's exactly another perfect example in the age of AI where it's like, well, what risks are ChatGPT and Claude going to make on our behalf? I mean, unless I go off hacking some other way.
TR: (29:02) Don't encourage them. That's not a challenge!
SM: (29:07) Exactly that. It's kind of that roll of the dice. And so I want to touch on a few of these that I've mentioned here.
29:13 So I mentioned random mode network effects, zagging, random mode particularly connecting to AI now is it's about (29:24) variance not volume and this is really similar with zagging right zagging and random mode are basically the same right what do I mean by that so the male economist Adam Smith invented the idea of specialization with labor and basically he used the example of like a pin factory and How before back in the day, we little history lesson for everyone is before these factory workers would spend all day to literally produce like three pins.
29:52 And then through specialization, which we still have now to this day, right? We have the different functions. Are you in sales? Are you in marketing? Through specialization on the factory line suddenly 10,000x that output?
30:05 So, coming back to variance, not volume today is the art of zagging. It's kind of like the risks, right? So, we're not operating in this productivity obsessed way in sales, I just need to like bang out a load more emails, which you could very easily get Claude to go and do that tomorrow, right? You right now just be like, "Right, bang out all these emails." It's more AI slop. It's more crap that you're putting out there. This is where it's actually standing out from the crowd.
What we talk about a lot as well is the personalization, a bit more of that research, finding a different way to maybe connect. Do you have mutual connections? So, that's kind of what I mean on random mode. This is backed up by another scientist I came across, Nobuko Nakano, who recently wrote a book called Lucky People. And I just love this quote that I want to read out:
"Lucky people also tend to score high on novelty-seeking. They try the unfamiliar restaurant. They take the scenic route. They talk to strangers."
And I love how this next line is written:
“Each small departure from routine is in effect a ticket and a lottery that the cautious never enter.”
How great is that?
TR: (31:25) I love that.
SM: (31:26) That's my whole point. Playing life on random mode, these kind of the art of zagging, the variance, not volume. We're not operating- we're not factory workers pumping out 3,000 pins anymore. (31:41) We've evolved from that. We've got AI and the robots to do that for us now. And again, great news for anyone who's neurodiverse. It's like, spice up your life, baby.
TR: That is really interesting because I'm not a very spontaneous person. Like outside of work stuff, I love a routine. I think I'm a bit boring sometimes.
I have a friend who last year was like, "Are you ready to do something insanely spontaneous?" And I was like, "I don't know. Can I think about it?" And because she used to work for a private jet company and there was an empty leg and she was like, "Come and get on a bloody private jet with me to New York. I won’t ask you twice. And she did not. And I was like, "I've got to do this. I've got to be spontaneous. Why am I not doing this?" So, we did it. And there were so many reasons why I'm so glad I did. It was the most amazing experience. Might never be on a private jet again in my life. There are so many things why it was incredible. She's a wonderful friend, all of that stuff. But ithe reason why I bring it up is to this day that post I did on LinkedIn is the only time I've ever gone viral.
SM: (32:55) Wow.
TR: (32:56) I had 100s of thousands of impressions. My followers jumped by thousands. And it's why I think the engagement I get now is pretty good.
All because of that one totally crazy choice I made and then posting it online.
SM: (33:12) Okay, I'm getting so excited here again! You sharing that story is the most perfect evidence for the variance not volume message that I'm drilling down here. (33:30) Because in the old school way of working, it was basically you could rely on the law of averages to get a bit more technical here. Now, what we're talking about in this new world is the power law is what reigns. The power law for anyone who hasn't heard of it is basically like the 80:20 rule on steroids.
TR: (33:51) Yeah.
33:52 And I'm linking this to your story on the virality piece, right? So, this wasn't just another average post. This was a spike in your metrics that has continued to have this longtail effect, that's continued to almost have this halo effect. So, again, you couldn't have handed me a more perfect example on that. It sounds like an amazing trip as well.
So that's one piece to it is the variance of not volume on kind of just the power law, but also saying yes to new things and I'm sure everyone's got a story.
TR: If you've got something and something's come up for you where you're like, "Oh my god, I said yes to this thing that I normally wouldn't have." And even if it's just kind of created this amazing memory for you, but I wouldn't be surprised if people have got these similar stories where they said yes to something and then it just had this like all of these steps along the way that led to something even better and better.
SM: Ripple effect of luck.
TR: (34:54) Ripple effect of luck. Exactly that.
SM: And we're gonna end on that note because you had another example where you said yes to something and it continued to have this huge ripple effect.
Just before we get to that, I've talked a bit about the random mode. I didn't touch on the network piece just because that's super important in sales;
There was this theory coined by a male sociologist in 1973 called The Strength of Weak Ties. As the name suggests, this is how many opportunities come our way through these second third degree connections. Now, I mentioned the year here specifically because it was more recently backed up like five years ago in a study analyzing 20 million LinkedIn users, which validated the same strength of weak ties theory that showed that acquaintances with whom you only share about 10 mutual connections are more than twice as as effective at helping people find new jobs than those strong ties.
TR: (36:00) Ah yes.
SM: (36:01) So there's all of this other kind of research and stuff that's being kind of put in to like prove this point, but those are at least some of many that really link more closely to the sales profession in particular. So dovetailing this back to your other lucky circumstance very much to do with like these network effects and saying yes to these other things was you speaking at an event for Allica Bank.
36:27 So, what happened there and what was the crazy ripple effect?
TR: (36:30) It was really funny. I was in this WhatsApp group for female founders and it was just such a busy group and one day I saw an event that they were putting on and I was like, "Oh, it's kind of come out through the noise and I can go do that, I'll go ahead." Met someone there who was brilliant. And I won't go into the whole song and dance of it because it you will have all heard it before on the follow-up episode, but basically had to chase her back and forth over eight times in different methods to secure a pitch to be able to even have a meeting with her. This was like pre- pitch follow-ups. 10, didn't care. And because I did that and I built the relationship, when the opportunity came up for her to have me speak, she called me and there I was in Somerset House with Allica Bank. And as I walk in and bearing in mind, I did not know this until a few months ago-
SM: (37:33) So funny.
TR: (37:34) Walk in and who's the first person I say hi to and introduce myself to? But it's Steph!
Steph sees me talk and then a few months later Steph is looking for subject matter experts and is recommended to speak to me and was like I actually already know that person because I've spoken to them before and then invited me on. The results were amazing and then I did what I think is probably the biggest risk I've ever made in my business which is to say yes to doing the podcast, right? Which has again opened the floodgates of opportunity.
(Watch the episode on YouTube, How one meeting can change everything).
And it all just came from a really busy WhatsApp group that I just took a chance on an event that I didn't know if it would be worth it. I took a chance on following up with someone because why not? What if that's the person? And literally every single action that I did all the way back for three and a half years ago is why we're sat here while you're listening there.
SM: (38:43) Isn't it crazy when you break it down - and this like just one of the branches of the positive ripple effect that I know that you met other people there other people saw you speak and so that again proves my point on kind of the open-mindedness taking a chance zagging as well you know I one of the other principles is strategic visibility and when you combine it with you know the power law and doing things that actually put you in a situation to get higher ROI.
39:12 So, specifically with this, what I mean is instead of like going along and attending event, you were one of the speakers. So, instead of trying to work the room and network with people, you're there visible to everyone.
TR: And instead of being a sales trainer, which is what I'd been pitching myself to her, I was speaking as a sales expert on a stage. And that completely changed the trajectory of my career.
SM: (39:35) Isn't it crazy, right?
TR: (39:38) I'm so lucky to you.
SM: (39:40) Likewise. Absolutely. So as soon as you start to become aware of these principles and for me it's about there's all of these sayings that we've heard of before but actually to your earlier point there is all of this science behind it and so yeah we've all heard of these things, like “roll the dice, “take a chance,” “say yes to these new opportunities that come your way,” but if you take anything away from this episode it's there's more in your control than you think and we have genuinely new opportunities now to work in ways that better serve us to get higher ROI in this age of AI that's kind of disrupting everything.
TR: (40:21) Yeah, absolutely. And you should probably get Steph to come in and speak to your team about hacking luck.
SM: (40:28) Love that. Appreciate it. Thank you.
TR: (40:33) So, if you're not currently sat at your laptop going to get in touch with Steph to book in a conversation with her so she can help you all hack luck, then instead you're hopefully subscribing and you're on your way to do that afterwards. Be a bit spontaneous. Do you not subscribe or follow any podcast? Maybe you should ask. Maybe you should give us a five star review. Take a chance! You never know what could happen!
So, as always, massively appreciate everyone who is listening. Massively appreciate you teaching us how to hack luck because I'm off to go do it immediately.
The S Word - the dirtiest word in business, and yet the lifeblood of ANY business! Podcast by Steph Melodia and Tash Rebuck blending B2B sales expertise and humour. Whether you're an SDR, a BDE, a Chief Revenue Officer or Commercial Director, this is the show for you.
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